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Maintankadin

[spoiler]Iron Council

Majiben
Sat Feb 28, 2009 2:38 pm
Well that's just plain false.
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Panzerdin
Sat Feb 28, 2009 2:53 pm
To be honest, Naxx 25 is something I wouldn't like to pug because you're reliant on certain people doing their damn job in certain places. Something is bound to go wrong.
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If you shoot Anthony several hundred times with an anti-tank rifle whilst he is stabbed to death by a squad of ninja monkeys, he will be dead.

OK?
Selinaria
Sat Feb 28, 2009 3:02 pm
My guild is pretty focused on 10 mans but we do pug 25 mans. Nath pugs are decent in being able to run away from crappy shit but actually laying out DPS.... yea not so much. Have no problem with most bosses in Naxx 25 pugs with the exception of Thaddius lol. Only rarely do we pug DPS good enough to beat the enrage timer.

That being said, I would be very worried if some of the 10 man bosses in Ulduar were not killable by people in 25 man gear since Blizzard is deliberately working around 2 different progression paths.

Essentially, by having a full set of 213 epics, you overgear Ulduar 10 right from the start.
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Majiben
Sat Feb 28, 2009 3:34 pm
Assuming you aren't on a back water server and also assuming most of the players in the pug have 25 man experience and gear. Those assumptions are not given and it is folly to say that any and all should have it. Ever try pugging a 25 man with people in 10 man gear and little to no experience? Well you're going to be unable to do more than the last 4 bosses.
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Amran20
Sun Mar 01, 2009 12:53 am
Did you take into consideration those who do only 10 mans with their guild, who *could* do naxx25 pugs but don't want to for multilple reasons?

A) Don't want to do stuff with morons.
B) Don't want to ruin the experience of outgearing Ulduar-10, which is what will be mainly focused on.
C) Would rather do something else rather than do the same instance twice in one week, just with more people?

C'mon maintankadin, I've been around for a long time, we all know better than to talk down to casual raiders.

Bad raiders are fine, but don't knock those who don't feel the need to be on the cutting edge of gear. We should be able to do the hard mode encounters simply on the merit of skill, not need Ulduar 25 gear to do them. (And trust me, I remember what it's like, being on the cutting edge of gear and such. When you look at it from an outsiders point of view like I am currently, it's really not all that impressive.)
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Dark Serenity's tankadin for life.
Selgar
Sun Mar 01, 2009 6:51 am
Pugging Naxx 25 is actually pretty easy. There are 4 people in my guild and we have 4 friends who are very well geared (the ones we run 10 man with) so we pug out 17 spots for naxx 25 each week. The first week we did it we cleared the 2 easy wings, by the 4th week (this week) we killed KT. It's really not that hard if you have patience and dont just auto invite every scrub in lfg (seriously if you are in lvl 78 greens wtf are you even in lfg for naxx 25), it's not that hard.
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Zironic
Sun Mar 01, 2009 6:54 am
It might not be horribly hard, however it is not expected, thus Ulduar 10 will be balanced for Naxx 10 gear and Whateverinstancecomesnext 10 will be balanced for ulduar 10 gear.

And even if naxx 25 is puggable I doubt Ulduar 25 will be and the system is meant to stay consistent.
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fafhrd
Sun Mar 01, 2009 11:35 am
No, your point is the same as his point, most of Naxx requires that a handful of people do their job without failing.

Thaddius is the only one that strictly requires everyone does his job without failing.
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1/1 Lore pre-nerf.
mavfin
Mon Mar 02, 2009 12:38 am
I do 10-man Naxx because that's what I want to do with my guildies. I *don't like* the 25-man format. It reminds me too much of the old 40-man raids where the tanks and healers worked, and the DPS played cards and watched TV.

I'm glad you can do Ulduar 10 with Naxx-10 gear. Requiring 25-man gear to do it doesn't make any sense.

Also, I like getting together 9 of my friends. I don't like getting together 19 of my friends and then having to invite 5 more complete idiots/assholes just to fill out the raid.
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--Mav