Kalecgos 1 tank SR strat...questions

I am completely against any type of loot restrictions.
All they do is breed contempt and disillusionment.

As guild leaders you should have enough faith in your members to trust that they make the right decisions regarding doing what's best for the guild.

That said, I took the first Tempest of Chaos that dropped because it was a substantial upgrade from my S2 gavel.
I also made a post on the guild forums ahead of time stating that it's was my intention to take A ToC whenever I had high enough DKP to win it. There were a couple people who were slightly unhappy but the overall majority of the guild was supportive including ALL of the locks and most of the mages. The biggest detractor oddly enough was a resto shaman though he was a big "old-school" bleeding edge raider.


On the other hand:
I've passed on all of the Supremus rings and RoS necks to Warriors and Druids because I thought they would get more use from them.

I passed on all of Myrmidon's Tread's until all the warriors prot & DPS had them. I took mine and then Tidestompers dropped the next week, lol.

I did the same thing with Girdles of Stability but unfortunately neither those or a Girdle of Mighty Resolve has dropped since the DPS warrior got his belt and I'm stuck with T5 level belts.

I passed the first Bulwark of Azinoth to a Warrior and then the first Kaz's Heart to the other warrior, those have been the only tanking shields to drop (and they were in that order).

I also passed the first Faceplate to a warrior.

Passed the first T6 bracers to a Priest so she could get her 4 piece bonus.

Passed several T6 helms and all of the T6 legs.
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For sake of clarification: I don't by any means think that the call we're arguing about was "the right one." If you look at this specific case, was there a poor allocation of the item? Yes - that's not what any of us are arguing. My point is just that a logical "general case" can lead to exception cases being missed, and this could well be one of them. A system driven by an ideal where the class who can best utilize an item receives priority on the item could produce this scenario. This would require a fairly extreme version of that view, but it's in the same vein as something that does make sense. It all stems from spellcrit being all-but-wasted itemization for a prot paladin, whereas the warlock would get full benefit from it. It's not nearly as big a difference as hunter melee weapons or warrior ranged weapons, but it is a disparity that allows one player to reap a larger benefit from it than the other.

If the rules are written such that class priority is more important than seniority, then that has nothing to do with disrespect: rules were written and agreed to, and now they are being enforced. I don't necesarily agree with that rule being set to this extreme, but I could imagine some people would - and in that case, it has nothing to do with class/player disrespect, just an execution of the rules.

(I should also probably mention that I come from a guild with an 8-12 week trial process... so some of our "tryouts" have made fairly significant contributions to the guild before ever being promoted to veteran member status. Two-month-old tryouts make for some fuzz in the terminology.)

-Splug
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(Usually) Prot warrior: http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Illidan&n=Splug

Yeah, that was my only point - such a loot system could be conceivable, and if that's the system posted, that should be the system used, and that leaving over a system that has been in place (and possibly benefited the player in question at some other point months ago when the tables were turned) is poor form. I think in such a case, this could be seen as a failure by the system that should be addresssed, and hopefully corrected.

-Splug
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(Usually) Prot warrior: http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Illidan&n=Splug

I think this discussion is getting closer, to what the real problem is with items like ToC.

Loot/dkp-rules.

As a raidleader since start of wow, i try to add another view for you.
I had the advantage, most guilds and raidleaders do not have.
To improve my dkp-system over time. There are several rules i had to change for more fairness, or to make sure, the right people are getting necessary upgrades. Or to change it as a whole (bid-system). I had to add special restrictions for legendarys etc.
After 3 years of raiding, i can say its really near perfect now, cause
we never ever had any big issues with loot in bc, but had lots of in vanilla.

Loot rules are something you can't really make across-the-board statements about. What's appropriate for one guild could be completely wrong for another.

For example, the casual "just a bunch of friends who get together and kill bosses sometime" crowd, that PVP's just as much as they raid, or brings alts, and so forth is usually best served by minimalistic loot policies. The "main tank" of that guild is quite often someone who respecs frequently, and sometimes is just whoever happens to be willing to spec prot for the evening.

The more serious "everything we do is in the name of progression" guilds tend to benefit the most from the more restrictive policies, because you want to put gear in the hands of the people who are going to use it to kill bosses.

You have to consider the people you're running with as well. If the casual guild mentioned above is so well-knit and selfless that you have trouble getting anyone to loot anything over anyone else, the most you probably need for loot distribution is random roll. However, if you have people who want more reward than just hanging out (which is fine), or have lots of turnover (and thus, new people coming in and rolling on the item that someone else has been lusting after since day 1), something like Suicide Kings or a zero-sum DKP system works great as well. Same goes for the more hardcore approach, in regards to DKP vs loot council.

In short, the best loot system is one that's at the very least been modified to fit your guild. Stealing one verbatim from another guild is risky at best.
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The danger must be growing, for the rowers keep on rowing!