Guide: Emblem of Triumph Pick Order (10 man Raider Edition)

Crossposted from: http://honorscode.blogspot.com/2009/08/ ... 0-man.html

When Wrath started Heroics and Naxx10 gave you level 200 gear. Naxx25 gave you level 213. Then Ulduar came out. Ulduar 10 gear was level 219, while Ulduar 25 gear was level 226.

Now with Crusade out you have 3 different levels. Crusade 10 will give you level 232 gear. Crusade 10 Heroic and Crusade 25 give level 245 gear. Crusade 25 Heroic gives the best gear at level 258.

The best gear from Heroic is available only after killing the last boss. The number of tokens you get will depend on how many 'tries' you had left.

Crusade 10, Crusade 10 Heroic and Cruasde 25 gear are all obtained with Emblems of Triumph. Crusade 10 gear is obtained with just Emblems of Triumph. Crusade 10 Heroic / Crusade 25 gear requires more Emblems as well as a Trophy that drops off the Bosses in 25man and from the Tribute Chest in Heroic 10. A full clear of the 25 man will yeild 15 Emblems and 5 trophies, a full clear of Heroic 10 man will yeild 15 Emblems and 2 to 4 trophies. You can also obtain Emblems from the Heroic Daily Quest.

What's really different about Tier 9 is that your pick order for Triumph badges really varies on what kind of content you'll be clearing. I'm going to look at this from the perspective of a 10 man Raider doing Heroic/Hard Mode.

With any pick order, use common sense when applying it to your own situation. My pick order is going to be influenced by my own situation, and I'll be sure to explain the reasons behind why I've used the pick order below. Keep in mind that you might get a drop that changes the pick order for you.

Book 'em Dano

Libram of Defiance 25 Emblems of Triumph

I recommend the first purchase be the Libram of Defiance. This Libram gives you a chance to gain 200 dodge rating for 18 sec. each time you use your Hammer of The Righteous ability. It has a very high uptime. I always try to gear for the hardest content available to me and right now that Heroic ToC. The bosses in there hit HARD, so I want all the avoidance and effective health I can get.

That has a nice ring to it

Clutch of Fortification 35 Emblems of Triumph

The next target is the ring. The reason I have this here is you won't be replacing it until Icecrown. Pair this baby up with the Loop of the Val'kyr from Heroic Twins and you've got quite a set. No other set of rings comes near the Stamina and Armor of these two rings.

Tiered Approach

Now you start thinking about Tier Gear. You might need to buy some iLevel 232 Tier 9 pieces to give you a better shot at clearing the instance and getting the trophies for the 245 pieces. Remember you can mix and max 232 and 245 to activate your 2 and 4 piece bonus.

Your goal is to build up to the 4 piece bonus as quickly as you can. I'm a big fan of the 4 peice bonus which makes Divine Protection (our Shield Wall) usuable every 90 seconds. That's incredible. You want that ability, and you want it now.

Tier Hands
Tier Legs
Tier Shoulders
Tier Chest
Faceplate of the Honorbound

Buy the non Trophy piece when have enough Emblems. As soon as your guild can clear Heroic and start getting Trophies, save up for the 245 piece, but don't start back at the top of the list. Keep going down the list and then go back and replace your 232 pieces after you get the Helm.

Normally I would support the idea of buying the most expensive piece first, but here's why I don't agree with that for EoTs. The Hands wind up on top by virtue of the other pieces having good alternatives.

Your Chest and Helm should already be iLevel 226 items because both are available from Conquest Emblems. In addition, Anub'arak drops a 232 Chest. That puts both items on a lower priority to be upgraded.

The Tier 8 Legs are very well itemized, probably the best itemized piece of Tier 8.

The Shoulders are lower on the pick order because there's a possible 232 and 245 drop available to you from the Faction Champions.

Once you are ready to replace the helm, I actually recommend the Faceplate of the Honorbound. It's the same iLevel as your Tier 9 (245) and I feel it's a better itemized piece. They have the same Armor and Stamina, but the Faceplate has superior avoidance, while T9 has superior threat. I gear for survival over threat. By using the Faceplate of the Honorbound, you will free up a Trophy to go to someone else in your raid making your whole team stronger.

Leave it on the shelf

Glyph of Indomitability

I'm not a fan of this trinket and wouldn't spend Emblems on it. It's a load of armor with a dodge on use. I prefer stamina which works against magic as well as physical, with an avoidance on use.

If you have more Emblems, buy Crusader Orbs and get some Saronite Swordbreakers made.

Honorshammer wrote:Your goal is to build up to the 4 piece bonus as quickly as you can. I'm a big fan of the 4 peice bonus which makes Divine Protection (our Shield Wall) usuable every 90 seconds. That's incredible. You want that ability, and you want it now.

Tier Hands
Tier Legs
Tier Shoulders
Tier Chest
Faceplate of the Honorbound

I don't think anyone will disagree that our 4-set bonus is worthwhile. However...

Honorshammer wrote:Once you are ready to replace the helm, I actually recommend the Faceplate of the Honorbound. It's the same iLevel as your Tier 9 (245) and I feel it's a better itemized piece. They have the same Armor and Stamina, but the Faceplate has superior avoidance, while T9 has superior threat. I gear for survival over threat.

I don't quite understand this. How can you say you gear for survival when you chose one of the two highest itemization slots on the character sheet(legs or chest, as they have more stats points allocated to them than any other gear slot) for block value and hit rating? They might have a 90 defense rating, and two gem slots, but so do these: I submit the Legguards of Feverish Dedication. http://www.wowhead.com/?item=47052 While outside of your 10-man-only rule, 25-man normal Lord Jaraxxus is easy enough to approach to make it worth aiming for these instead of tier pants and go for your helm to complete the 4-set bonus instead.

Honorshammer wrote:Glyph of Indomitability

I'm not a fan of this trinket and wouldn't spend Emblems on it. It's a load of armor with a dodge on use. I prefer stamina which works against magic as well as physical, with an avoidance on use.

If you have more Emblems, buy Crusader Orbs and get some Saronite Swordbreakers made.

BTW, I completely agree with this. That trinket is pretty awful.

OFC what gear to choose from Tier is up to each person, depending on what he likes.

I would for sure use nontier shoulders instead of another slot.

Both the EoT shoulders and the ones dropped inside Toc10 hc are full of awesomesauce.


I would definately get the Trinket though for any physical fight. That amount of armor will for sure benifit me more than another stam trinket.

Nice effort, but the best tip is: Spam LFM 25 ToC, clear the ini, grab some 25 loot. Casual ftw. :[

Alanyor wrote:Nice effort, but the best tip is: Spam LFM 25 ToC, clear the ini, grab some 25 loot. Casual ftw. :[

While you're right this is doable given the difficulty (pugged it last night, got gear but not much enjoyment) I really appreciate and want to encourage this kind of thread on a hardcore site. We stick to 10s simply because for us its far more fun and time-efficient. I love the puzzle of maximization though, so much of my time is spent parsing 25 man advice and see if it stands up in a 10 man perspective.

Thanks a ton for the write-up, now back to staring at the EoT vendor / character pane.

Aenema wrote:I would definately get the Trinket though for any physical fight. That amount of armor will for sure benifit me more than another stam trinket.

Name me a single fight in Ulduar where all your only concern was physical damage. Armor is important, but as far as trinkets go, Stam > Armor. And BTW, the one fight in GToC where you really need to stack your mitigation/advoidance, i.e. Gormok the Impaler, his biggest damage move (and the one that's been kicking our ass) is a bleed effect. -_-

Solare wrote:

Aenema wrote:I would definately get the Trinket though for any physical fight. That amount of armor will for sure benifit me more than another stam trinket.

Name me a single fight in Ulduar where all your only concern was physical damage. Armor is important, but as far as trinkets go, Stam > Armor. And BTW, the one fight in GToC where you really need to stack your mitigation/advoidance, i.e. Gormok the Impaler, his biggest damage move (and the one that's been kicking our ass) is a bleed effect. -_-

I know armor is only real good in an all physical fight, just saying there is no reason not to get the trinket if you have the EOTs anyway..

Honors, love the list.

I'd also like to add the "Tier 2 refurbished" Helm from Onyxia, which will be available next month from Onyxia.
It's an ilvl 232 item with highest EH available to 10 man raiders.

I'd recommend it over the Faceplate of the Honorbound, unless you are swimming in badges.

Aenema wrote:I would definately get the Trinket though for any physical fight. That amount of armor will for sure benifit me more than another stam trinket.

Um... probably not. For effective health purposes, 11 Armor is roughly equivalent to 1 stamina for a paladin. So that trinket is about equal to 163 STA, or almost identical to Heart of Iron, which is 19 ilvls lower. And the stamina is far more versatile.

Admittedly, if you're limiting your options to 10-man progression only, then there aren't as many choices. Royal Seal of King Llane is the only Stamina trinket I can think of from 10-mans.

Solare wrote:

Aenema wrote:I would definately get the Trinket though for any physical fight. That amount of armor will for sure benifit me more than another stam trinket.

Name me a single fight in Ulduar where all your only concern was physical damage. Armor is important, but as far as trinkets go, Stam > Armor. And BTW, the one fight in GToC where you really need to stack your mitigation/advoidance, i.e. Gormok the Impaler, his biggest damage move (and the one that's been kicking our ass) is a bleed effect. -_-

Correction: his biggest damage move applies a bleed debuff. The debuff, however, is nothing compared to the direct physical damage that it deals (over 40k towards the end of the fight on 25-man).

Solare wrote:

Honorshammer wrote:I don't quite understand this. How can you say you gear for survival when you chose one of the two highest itemization slots on the character sheet(legs or chest, as they have more stats points allocated to them than any other gear slot) for block value and hit rating? They might have a 90 defense rating, and two gem slots, but so do these: I submit the Legguards of Feverish Dedication. http://www.wowhead.com/?item=47052 While outside of your 10-man-only rule, 25-man normal Lord Jaraxxus is easy enough to approach to make it worth aiming for these instead of tier pants and go for your helm to complete the 4-set bonus instead.

Sorry, my guild doesn't do 25 mans. Nice pants though.

Before you can clear Heroic ToC10, the 10 man raider has two shots at an ilevel 245, the Faceplate and the Shoulders. While BV is EH, i'm already approaching the point of Dimishing Returns, and I like the extra defense on the Faceplate.

Belloc wrote:The debuff, however, is nothing compared to the direct physical damage that it deals (over 40k towards the end of the fight on 25-man).

I disagree. The direct damage of impale, while certainly not insignificant, and a significant source of danger due to spike damage, is only a significant source of spike damage due to it coming in conjunction with the impale dot.

http://www.wowmeteronline.com/combat/detail/198149988#damagetaken

This is in heroic 25-man.

This is a go where the other tank died for some reason after being impaled once, so I got impaled 13 times, so pretty much the absolute worst case scenario, I think I had 7 stacks of impale on me at the end because I bubbled to remove the first 6 after the other tank taunted.

Total damage taken from Impale direct damage: 305981
Total damage taken from Impale dot: 1368936

I took over 4 times the damage from the dot as from the direct damage. Also, the stamina helps with both, the armor does absolutely nothing for the dot.

Max hit from Impale direct damage: 28868
Max hit from Impale dot: 42441

It's not even close in any regard.

theckhd wrote:

Aenema wrote:I would definately get the Trinket though for any physical fight. That amount of armor will for sure benifit me more than another stam trinket.

Um... probably not. For effective health purposes, 11 Armor is roughly equivalent to 1 stamina for a paladin. So that trinket is about equal to 163 STA, or almost identical to Heart of Iron, which is 19 ilvls lower. And the stamina is far more versatile.

Admittedly, if you're limiting your options to 10-man progression only, then there aren't as many choices. Royal Seal of King Llane is the only Stamina trinket I can think of from 10-mans.

Yes and thus I'm aiming for that EoT Trinket quite quick. I'm in a 10 man only guild, partly cus we enjoy doing 10 mans more, and partly because we cannot find enough players that are both good players and good people aswell.
Gone through 4 rogues in 3 months lately.. All of them have been utter morons

Salamandra wrote:I disagree. The direct damage of impale, while certainly not insignificant, and a significant source of danger due to spike damage, is only a significant source of spike damage due to it coming in conjunction with the impale dot.

Just wait until you happen to get that 40k impale 0.2s after 16k normal melee hit. That was on 10-man heroic, on 25-man it's probably a bit more complicated. Dot part is easy to heal through, in 25-man normals we do tank swaps at 5-6 stacks.

But my previous post just explained that... you don't get 40k impale direct damages. At most I got 28.8k on 25-man heroic. My max dot tick was FAR more than that, and the dot ticks much more often than you get impales.

My point was to show that not only is the dot not insignificant to the direct damage, it actually does a hell of a lot more damage, also comes in conjunction with melee hits, and that stacking armor is bollocks compared to stacking stamina for the reason of the bleed. Stamina helps with both, armor does not.