[Druid] Bear Discussion

This is being brought over from the 85 tank comparison thread
we can talk about bear mechanics and gearing here, that way the original thread can be used to discuss all the tanking classes/specs

EDIT: The Inconspicuous Bear - MTadin for ferals

to go off what arcand said, i found that yes aoe sucks on my bear
but if i dont do a pull right on my warrior (very close in gearing) aoe sucks on her too

for aoe pulls, esp major ones, i will charge, berserk, thrash, mangle-tab, swipe, mangle-tab, .......
keeping thrash on cd, but still mangle-tabbing and keeping maul used as much as possible

but then again, aoe has always been a bitch for bears
we excel at single target

edit: oops knew i was forgetting something
my rotation is mostly muscle memory now so i dont even realize what buttons im hitting sometimes

No Swipe? I'm keenly aware that many of the pulls you're talking about last longer than the duration of Berserk, so it's not like you can just Mangle your way to victory. I'm bad at bear though, so I dunno.

I'm having some big problems with AoE threat on my bear, too. Marking doesn't even help in PuGs - they figure the icons are there for decoration.

I'm sporting a 336 gear rating in baby norms (running with my wife's 83 mage so we get Throne, Vortex, and Blackrock) with 81s through 83s, and I can't hold against AoE spells unless they hold off for a while.

Yes, I know they are supposed to, but we all know they don't. I had a hunter and rogue both pull aggro when I was pulling a boss to me instead of charging at it, because I wanted to position the Nasty Circles he creates. Two classes with misdirects almost died by pulling aggro on the pull. Pro players.

So let's just forget what people are supposed to do, and come up with ways to handle what they really do. Thrash with mangle-tab takes way too long to set up before AoEs commence. Thrash-Swipe then mangle tab is still too weak to hold in the opening seconds.

For you successful bears out there, what is your pull sequence for a group of 4-5 mobs assuming little to no reliable CC avaialable (as in your hunter uses Ice Trap to CC his target instead of Freezing Trap)?

see my first post in this thread for my mass aoe pulls, but you have to remember that bear threat is tied directly to our weapon
if you look at my armory for catagon, you will notice he has the heroic polearm from VP

when i got that, my threat issues dropped alot, and if someone does pull one off me, esp single target, then they should have the gear to handle tanking himn for a sec

tl;dr threat low? get a better weapon

Koatanga wrote:Two classes with misdirects almost died by pulling aggro on the pull. Pro players. Let's just forget what people are supposed to do, and come up with ways to handle what they really do.

Unless it leads to wipes, talk it over with your healer and consider letting them use the threat wipe that Fury warriors and Enhancement shamans depend on. (i.e., death) Mark a skull, tell them to kill that before they AOE, and if they decide to do otherwise, well ... they clearly are aware of the consequences.

Also, using CC means you have fewer adds to control, and AOE is less tempting.

Kelaan wrote:
Also, using CC means you have fewer adds to control, and AOE is less tempting.

this is the main reason to cc when you are playing a bear

fewer adds to try to control = fewer targets for your dps to nuke = less mobs being pulled off of you due to abysmal aoe = less headaches for you and your healer

Fewer targets also makes it harder for DPS to choose the wrong one. /wishfulthinking

Kelaan wrote:Fewer targets also makes it harder for DPS to choose the wrong one. /wishfulthinking

That's odd because the dps I know think the opposite.

The transformation of a trash mob to Frog form via Hex makes it the most dangerous creature in all of Wow. All dps must switch to the frog immediately and nuke it down before tribal Amazon indians skewer the frog, put it over a fire and then dip their arrows into the Frog's juices to make poison arrows which they will then use them on the 5 man heroic party.

Frog>>>>>>>>>>skull on all levels.

Trust me on this one. Just trust me. My shaman speaks the truth.

Kelaan wrote:Fewer targets also makes it harder for DPS to choose the wrong one. /wishfulthinking

but they will pick the one you mangle last every time

I definitely understand the use of CC - it also buys me time while they are putting their CC up and changing targets.

The problem is when you mark a trap, the hunter trap-pulls, and you have the whole group walking slowly toward you through a patch of frost. Or they're on fire. Or being bitten by snakes. Basically anything except the popsicle you were expecting.

How they get through 80-odd levels without learning what trap does what is beyond me.

And god forbid you pull a group within 10 miles of the next group, or you can expect an autoshot-pull.

I also mark a skull for each pull, signifying the last thing I want killed, apparently.

in my expirience with pugs
skull = ignore til everything else, including the next 3 trash pulls and/or boss, is down
moon = OMG! KILLER SHEEP/FROG! KILL KILL KILL
square = cold mob, light it on fire! (or lonely mob, needs some snakes for pets)
diamond = WTF i cant banish it! ouch my face! NUKE IT!(note: if not demon/elemental i say fear if possible on diamond)
star = pickpocket, then ambush/backstab (actually had a rogue ask me wtf sap was /facepalm)
X = aoe everything
Circle = bah the other guy will get this one, ill "cc" the other mark (i use this for second sap/sheep/fear w/e i have 2 of)

Whatever you do, don't try to LoS any casters. Apparently when you say "This is a LoS pull", the warriors and pet classes read "charge in and stun as many things as possible before".

DPS love it when you pull mobs back, because that gives them an opportunity to put DoTs on everything as they come in...

thatguy wrote:

Kelaan wrote:Fewer targets also makes it harder for DPS to choose the wrong one. /wishfulthinking

That's odd because the dps I know think the opposite.

The transformation of a trash mob to Frog form via Hex makes it the most dangerous creature in all of Wow. All dps must switch to the frog immediately and nuke it down before tribal Amazon indians skewer the frog, put it over a fire and then dip their arrows into the Frog's juices to make poison arrows which they will then use them on the 5 man heroic party.

Frog>>>>>>>>>>skull on all levels.

Trust me on this one. Just trust me. My shaman speaks the truth.

I've got it! Use the frog as your marking tool! Since everyone seems to want to target it anyway...

When I'm on my DK, I try to avoid aoeing the entire group (ie. Howling Blast to get FF running) until I know the tank has the group situated. If that means the other dps has killed an unmarked mob before I jump in... so be it, but I don't want to be blamed for pulling aggro .

Something about this thread just reminds me of this

FFF(bear) should interrupt/silence.

That is all.

fuzzygeek wrote:FFF(bear) should interrupt/silence.

That is all.

/agreed

Then we could just add damage to it/make it bounce to other targets and viola! Captain America for Bears!

Seriously though, bears don't have an interrupt?

Skye1013 wrote:Then we could just add damage to it/make it bounce to other targets and viola! Captain America for Bears!

Seriously though, bears don't have an interrupt?

skull bash....
thats it, bash never works for me (maybe its cause im not hit-capped)

bldavis wrote:thats it, bash never works for me (maybe its cause im not hit-capped)

Never fear! 4.1 will fix it!

Most irritatingly bears don't have a ranged silence. Separating casters is an exercise in frustration.

fuzzygeek wrote:FFF(bear) should interrupt/silence.

That is all.

thus me agreeing with this idea
if it was ness, we could have a sunder armor type ability for the armor reduc, but im not sure if i really wanna be a furry warrior

edit: abbreviations are hard

Nah, even better are when the tank asks the group to do their CC, but to let the hunter trap pull.

And your genius retadin runs in before the trap pull happens, hits Repentance on the skull...then attacks it.

After the second time of that shit, I quit CCing. I figure if the retadin was that eager to die, I was happy to accomodate.

Ring of Frost will be used when no one expects it and it is actually harmful.

At what point did this steer away from bears...? Cause I think I missed it.

Polar bears are cool and koalas aren't actually bears! (See I'm on topic...)

Last night I ran Lost City.

WTF are we supposed to do about the croc adds? Taunt one of them every 8 seconds? I even tried Challenging Roar, which they ignored completely. Even attacking one of them with a full solo threat rotation did not grab him off the healer, and I have 3 more of them to pick up.

Any advice?