All Things Mr. Robot!

Jeremoot wrote:According to the forums, it does. There's a sticky somewhere that explains they take procs into account when balancing dodge/parry.

I thought it was the other way around, actually. In that they don't account for the WW proc in balancing dodge/parry, because there's no obviously correct way to do so.

Jeremoot wrote:I tried clearing my cache and hard-refreshing the page. Still, even with the feast/cauldron option unchecked, it's trying to use Feast / Cauldron. That's with ANY of the pre-sets, as well as custom weights were I set dodge / parry to 0.

Wait, I misunderstood then. If you check Feast/Cauldron, it will force Feast/Cauldron, which is what I thought you were asking. If you un-check it, it should use whatever gets you closest to 102.4%. Since they bumped Stamina up to a ridiculous 1.5 weighting, that should heavily favor the flask over the elixir options, but I have no idea why it won't go for mastery food (especially if you set dodge/parry to zero).

I'll have to play with it some today, since I logged out in tank gear.

It's sort of frustrating that they had it pretty much right, and then kept changing things in such a way as to make it useless again.

Yes, it's really frustrating. Before this change it was behaving exactly how I wanted it to. I'll set hit to next priority after expertise soft cap and it's telling me to use feast/cauldron, and reforge 5% hit away to get avoidance up to CTC cap rather than getting that CTC from Mastery food and elixirs. WITH 0 rating for Dodge / Parry. In the developer world we tend to call this "borked."

Here's a quick screencap, dodge and parry set to 0, Feast / Cauldron unchecked. Yet, it's reforging AWAY from hit and mastery to give me 4% more dodge.



Weights I was using that worked perfectly fine before the recent change:

MH DPS 0.85
MH Speed 1.7
Mastery 2
Exp 1.65 (Soft cap weight: 0.7)
Sta 1.5
Hit 1.08
Dodge 0.75
Parry 0.75
Strength 0.66
Armor 0.5
Crit 0.5
Agility 0.4
Haste 0.2

I've been conversing with yellowfive on the AMR forums about this. Basically, they built the CTC toggle into the default algorithm, and have made some tweaks that reduce the direct influence of the stat weights. In other words, the stat weights are more "suggestions" than strict parameters now. They say the presets work much better now (which I could maybe believe; the PvE default set seems to be working properly, at any rate. However, it makes the custom weights setting basically useless, because your means of control (the stat weights) is disregarded in many cases.

I've suggested they revert the custom stat weights setting, such that in that setting alone you get the "prioritize CTC" button, and more direct input from the stat weights. We'll see if they implement it. If they do, hopefully they can satisfy both parts of the population. If not, the tool will become fairly useless to anyone who actually wants to play with stat weights and customize their builds for specific bosses.

Personally, the site is completely useless to me if it doesn't take into account my stat weights.

Do you know of any other sites that will do gemming as well as reforging? I've seen sites that will reforge your gear based on your stat weights, but it won't incorporate gems as well. That was the selling point of AskMrRobot for me.

Jeremoot wrote:Personally, the site is completely useless to me if it doesn't take into account my stat weights.

Do you know of any other sites that will do gemming as well as reforging? I've seen sites that will reforge your gear based on your stat weights, but it won't incorporate gems as well. That was the selling point of AskMrRobot for me.

I've kind of given up on Ask Mr. Robot for my tankadin since the lock gem and enchant feature doesn't work for me. I've gone back to only using chardev. It doesn't have an optimizer, but you can customize your char exactly how you want to.

The sort-of-work around I'm using is to do one suggested change, log out, reload, do one suggested change, log out, reload, until everything is done. It's a pain in the ass, but it seems to be working for me.

Jeremoot wrote:Personally, the site is completely useless to me if it doesn't take into account my stat weights.

Do you know of any other sites that will do gemming as well as reforging? I've seen sites that will reforge your gear based on your stat weights, but it won't incorporate gems as well. That was the selling point of AskMrRobot for me.

I'll toss out chardev.org again and agree with Korendil. No automation with a super "optimize" button but it lets you load your character and change everything about your gems and reforging letting you find out what is best.

Jeremoot wrote:

Gab wrote:

Cowmmunion wrote:(thanks blizzard, for giving noooo dodge gear)

Not a whole lot of consolation but our weapon enchant (Windwalk) and most of the relevant trinkets are dodge or have use/proc being dodge. Stay of execution, Fire of the Deep, Moonwell Vial, Vial of Stolen Memories, the new HoT proc one etc... So it gets a little closer to being balanced during WW proc or use/proc of the these trinkets. Doubt that Mr. Robot takes these things into account though.

According to the forums, it does. There's a sticky somewhere that explains they take procs into account when balancing dodge/parry.

I tried clearing my cache and hard-refreshing the page. Still, even with the feast/cauldron option unchecked, it's trying to use Feast / Cauldron. That's with ANY of the pre-sets, as well as custom weights were I set dodge / parry to 0.

This is something I do not particularly like. I have never been a fan of any site or calculations that take procs into account because you never know if the proc is going to be there when you need it. If (when I had it) windwalk proc'd, that's a little extra dodge on top of the cake. If it was on ICD, then I'm still at tCTC.

Fenrìr wrote:This is something I do not particularly like. I have never been a fan of any site or calculations that take procs into account because you never know if the proc is going to be there when you need it. If (when I had it) windwalk proc'd, that's a little extra dodge on top of the cake. If it was on ICD, then I'm still at tCTC.

As I said earlier, jeremoot is incorrect. They don't take procs into account for the CTC calculation.

theckhd wrote:As I said earlier, jeremoot is incorrect. They don't take procs into account for the CTC calculation.

Ah, cheers for the bookmark. I don't really browse the AMR forums so I would have easily missed this.

I must have read it wrong, sorry for the confusion. Also, last time I used Chardev they hadn't updated for 4.3 yet, I'll have to take a look into it now.

Jeremoot wrote:I must have read it wrong, sorry for the confusion. Also, last time I used Chardev they hadn't updated for 4.3 yet, I'll have to take a look into it now.

I don't know what's going on with it. He said he'd not be updating it, but a big release was done after that statement and constant bug fixes have been implemented as well.

Jeremoot wrote:I must have read it wrong, sorry for the confusion. Also, last time I used Chardev they hadn't updated for 4.3 yet, I'll have to take a look into it now.

He updated it for 4.3, but did state this was the last one (granted he said that for 4.2).

Just tried MrRobot and they've appear to have fixed it. If you use custom weights it actually takes them into consideration now.

Regarding the Lifebound Alchemist Stone and Mr. Robots BIS gear: is that accurate? I've got that trinket in my bags, but I always run with Veil of Lies and Fire of the Deep equipped. Should I drop one of those for the alchemist trinket?

Is there a way to make sure Mr Robot is taking into account raid buffs? Right now it's assuming I have no raid buffs, which leads to an over-CTC.

Long time reader......first time posting.
I have been reading through this thread and noticed that there was a bit of debate as to if it was balancing dodge and parry correctly.
Seems like when I run my pally's through it it makes me very heavy on parry.
So I was just wondering what the forum had decided as far as if this is working properly and should be followed, or is it better off avoided and figure gemming and reforging out for yourself?

Wanna wrote:Long time reader......first time posting.
I have been reading through this thread and noticed that there was a bit of debate as to if it was balancing dodge and parry correctly.
Seems like when I run my pally's through it it makes me very heavy on parry.
So I was just wondering what the forum had decided as far as if this is working properly and should be followed, or is it better off avoided and figure gemming and reforging out for yourself?

I have ditched Mr. Robot in favor of Chardev.org. Mr. Robot acts strangely at times and the buffs are not customizable. Chardev doesn't do anything automatically for you but is much more versatile.

I've sort of given up on Mr. Robot, to be honest. It's still doing some weird things for me, such as making gemming mistakes on the valor belt, or not updating the sidebar stats when I manually lock things in place. And it's still over-valuing dodge/parry, but using custom weights turns off the block-capping algorithm. It's even doing things like replacing a Puissant gem with a Solid gem in helm (foregoing +30 dodge bonus) instead of cloak (foregoing +10 parry bonus) in an effort to equalize dodge/parry, despite it being a net loss of avoidance overall.

In short, it's doing dumb things. It's probably fine for a rough estimate of what you should be doing, but when you're down to tweaking a few gems here and there, it's not very useful. I've just been using CharDev and following a simple "maximize mastery from all sources, then convert gems to Solid in order of greatest efficiency" algorithm.

I'd love to see it fixed, but last time I tried to help (to get them to add the "cap CTC, stack stamina" setting) it felt like pulling teeth. And they still didn't implement it properly (dodge/parry weightings are too high). So, at this point I'm not inclined to force the issue.

Chardev is good for now, and certainly preferable to Mr Robot in its current state. The problem is that, as far as I know, development has stopped on Chardev, so it is unlikely to be updated come MoP unless someone else takes up the reins. The first few weeks of 4.3, before Chardev was updated, were quite frustrating; I'm not looking forward to repeating that experience.

Well, keep in mind that Mr. Robot will probably work great in MoP. Removing block-capping from the equation means that a lot of the code that's causing problems will be eliminated. As long as we can work out a simple set of mostly-static stat weights, Mr. Robot will be reliable. It's just that right now, it's doing silly things because the default stat weights are screwy and the custom stat weights simply don't work because they don't enforce block cap.