What am I doing wrong?

Recent result of an attempted heroic daily. Every group I've recently joined has said the exact same thing, and it still didn't go too bad. This time, the group didn't carry through though. I had to step away for a second and they all left. They didn't want to run with me, just like any other 5 man I have recently tried to tank. I have so many horror stories about trying to run 5 mans on this server as a Prot paladin. As you can see in my screenshot there, those are my avoidance values.....

Here's my armory link: http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=The+Underbog&n=Sequel

I have virtually EVERYTHING that's on the Uncrushability guide here: http://maintankadin.failsafedesign.com/viewtopic.php?t=4844

Even a few upgrades. Aside from my essence, everything contributes something towards my tanking.

Why are people reacting like this toward my gear? I have the basic minimum that all threads on here state I should have for kara.. I know my HP is still low, blah blah blah, I have way over 490 DEF and I am uncrushable with buff food and agility elixir. I realize you don't need to be uncrushable for heroics, but what do I need to do? I at least figured all the avoidance wouldn't make me take so much damage. Yes, I do agree with them that I take more damage than I should... but do I need to get a seperate set of gear for heroics? I mean, how am I even supposed to obtain gear upgrades if people won't even let me tank heroic groups for them let alone kara? Honestly, all I want to do is raid as a prot paladin. I love tanking and wish I would have started doing it way before now instead of wasting so much time on my rogue. But the guild I migrated to this server to help reconstruct isn't making any attempt whatsoever to return to its previous state of raiding. So I'm basically stuck on this low population server as an "undergeared" prot paladin without any other guilds to join because of the current state of my gear or lack of need for my class. I was holy before, but the addons I use make healing way too easy, thus making it boring as hell, so I gathered this prot set and respecced.

What am I doing wrong, what do I need to change, where do I need to go, what do I need to do. I'm open to anything right now.

This isn't a QQ , this is simply a last desperate attempt at gaining advice as to what I need to do to move up. I feel like I've been working at this all summer and have gained absolutely nothing. Any advice would be more than appreciated.

At your gear level, becoming uncrushable is almost a nerf, due to all the stamina you'll be missing out on. You also only need 485 defense. The end of Blood Furnace heroic without a warlock is tough on even overgeared tanks (Felguards hit for 4.5K and cleave for more), so it's probably not a good choice of a starter heroic.

A) Don't ever use parry gems. Parry rating converts to parry % at a much lower rate than dodge converts to dodge %. For mitigation purposes, they're identical, so there's no real reason to use them.
B) Get the Netherwing Defender's shield. It's available from a small solo quest chain with a 5man group quest at the end.
C) Get a stamina trinket. Darkmoon Card: Vengeance may be the best choice.
D) Get better shoulders. There aren't many you can get without running instances, so prioritize this slot.
E) Get Cloak of Eternity made. It's the best cloak even through Karazhan.
F) You don't have to match the sockets when you gem. You just don't get the bonus if you don't. In most cases, it's not worth it, so gem for straight stamina.
G) Enchant your shield with 18 Stamina. It's a cheap enchantment considering its stat bonus.
H) Buy rep with Aldor for the Vindicator's Hauberk. It's an excellent starter tanking chest.
I) Run some regular instances. Yeah, it'll suck to recruit for, but that's your current gear level. Shoot for regular Botanica to get your Dungeon Set shoulders from Laj.
J) Enchant your bracers.
K) Run regular Durnholde. It gives rep up til revered, is easy for a Paladin to tank, and is made for level 66s anyway. This will get you some practice, and rep towards Timewarden's Leggings and the glyph for your helm.
L) Your health will matter infinitely more than your avoidance to PuGs. Whether they're right or wrong, it's a good idea to have a lot of health, so maximize it.
M) Bring CC. When you overgear the instance, you won't need it, but for now, it'll make even the toughest dungeons seem trivial. Go out of your way to recruit rogues, mages, and warlocks over DPS shamans, warriors, and (most) hunters.
N) Being uncrushable isn't a big deal til Prince, and possibly Nightbane in Karazhan.
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Stormreaver US

Modus | Governor

First of all, thank you for such a fast and also comprehensive reply.

BF was the daily heroic, I heard it wasn't too difficult and although I'd never done it before even on my rogue, I figured I'd give it a shot.

A) Yeah, I was examining my gems earlier today and realized this. My friend was giving me freebie gems a while back for my stuff so I just threw it in there, not realizing which ones were maximizing my avoidability percentage.

B) I actually just did the quest today and pick the other shield, http://www.wowhead.com/?item=31490 ...I figured the agility and the extra stats would be better than a small bit of spell damage and INT, especially considering my weapon is actually pretty decent.... but would one of those really be better than my Shield of The Wayward?

C) I've been looking at several different trinkets to try and replace my silly healing trinket with. I know the stam trinkets will benefit me a lot, but the darkmoon faire just passed and building a deck isn't really the cheapest thing to do, either. I think something would be more obtainable within the months time anyway. I'd also been wanting to strive for the commendation, but I can't even get through reg magisters with a group let alone the heroic..... I'll have to research this more. I'm a JC so I might just work on rep for thrallmar and get the figure patterns.

D) I had researched my shoulder choices as well and these seem like the best ones for right now.. I'll check again and hopefully find something better.

E) Yeah, I know about the cloak, but NOBODY has the pattern on this server. I've spent days spamming trade and haven't gotten one reply. I'm only a couple more badges away from the 35 badge cloak, so I think I'll probably just have to wait this one out...

F) I know, like I said before I was just using what I was given.

G) Will do.

H) Been saving for my epic flyer lately, have to pay back what I was loaned then I'm spending everything on my aldor rep....

I) Yeah, I have been, for rep runs and whatnot.

J) Will do.

K) Its AWFUL trying to find people for OHB, I've only gotten in one good run since being here on this server... I know I need to but

L) I figured, I just guess I misunderstood the importance of uncrushability for what I'm going to be tanking. I hate being 10x more gear dependant than my rogue.

M) Already try to.

N) So unless I'm tanking one of these bosses, I really just need to focus on my HP for now?

You need to make the JC figurine then. And yes, you need to focus on your HP mostly til then.

EDIT: And spec into Kings and use it at all times.
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Stormreaver US

Modus | Governor

your original shield (shield of the wayward footman) is better for avoidance in my opinion. it gives defense rating and block rating... the extra AGI wont give you as much as the block rating
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Okay, this has been a really helpful start, thanks so much for the responses.

Any other input would still be appreciated as well.

When you're doing Heroics, this should be your checklist:

1. Get Uncrittable (485 Defense).
2. Get as much Stamina and Armor as possible.
3. Try and boost your Avoidance (Dodge/Parry) whilst keeping Sta/Armor as high as possible.
4. Don't try and AoE tank them until you're wearing near-full Kara/Badge epics.

This is only for Heroics or Offtanking. You'll need to be uncrushable, etc if you ever tank a raid boss.
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I don't wish to come across as surly or mean-spirited, but I am, so that's how it comes out.
Armory : Gear Advice

As a side note, I really hate it when I read someone giving someone concise, useful advice and then the OP goes "any other input?"
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I don't wish to come across as surly or mean-spirited, but I am, so that's how it comes out.
Armory : Gear Advice

Do the dailies for the SSO shields, they have loads of block, high armour and although they dont have loads of avoidance, a +15 shield block rating on a Sunward Crest will really help you.

It IS VERY HARD for people at your current gear level, I do sympathise. Have you tried getting alts of people more progressed to run with you as a tank? That might be an option.

I think you need to just hit heroic Mechanar and Slave Pens hard and save up for the badge gear.

Best of luck

Barathorn
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'Don't mind Guillex, he thinks he's Dorvan' - Lore at his best March 2008.

http://armorylite.com/eu/Aerie+Peak/Barathorn

I totally sympthize and wished to ask a similar question, so I hope to add to this discussion rather than derail it. Many many thanks to the vet pallies dedicating your time to helping those of us just getting our feet wet.

I actually managed to tank Prince this weekend (OMG, what a bad view! I have three other toons exalted with the Violet Eye, two healers and a mage, and never realized how that fight looks up close and personal), but still found regular MgT to be a struggle - even after the nerf. (Yay slightly less OP Glaive Throwers!) CC helped a lot and I donned healing gear for the Priestess event.

However, I found OHB to be a nightmare to tank since the last boss cleanses buffs. My group lost salvation, I lost RF, and with nothing beating on me I wasn't taking near as much damage as everyone else. RF takes a ton of mana to keep having to spam. I wound up taunt tanking the last dragon every time, hoping we could kill him before someone died. By comparison Prince was easy O.o (I had the benefit of two excellent healers, two hunters to MD, and of course, he is a demon....)

I am working on the SSO rep to get the shield, but I haven't decided which would really be more beneficial - the avoidance or threat one.

For trash is kings really better than sanctuary? I've been using Sanc for the threat and damage reduction, though 10% more stats would be a substantial increase in avoidance and a nice hit point boost. If Kings is generally better, is there a time when Sanc is situationally more useful?

I absolutely love tanking on my pally, but am overwhelmed by how much I don't know....
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The last boss of OHB only dispells buffs as long as there is the buff on him. It can be spellstolen by a mage, Arcane Shot by a Hunter, dispelled by a Priest, eaten by a Felhunter, and Shield Slammed by a prot warrior (lol if you brought one). There's no guarantee you'll have one of those classes, but it certainly is a huge help when you do.

For virtually everything, Kings is better than Sanctuary. For most paladins, it gives around 0.6% dodge (mostly a bonus on base agility), and 10% stamina. The mitigation from Sanctuary is trivial except in large scale (6+) AoE situations, and even then, your healers will hardly notice. The threat portion is also hardly noticeable, and would probably be easily overcome by a Wizard Oil. Blessing of Sanctuary, and that we have to pick it up for Holy Shield, is a topic of QQ currently regarding our WotLK talents. I only use it when I have all other Paladin buffs that I like.
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Stormreaver US

Modus | Governor