Minimise damge taken by not using AutoAttack?

Imagine you are tanking a fight like Kalecgos. Its near the kill and the enrage is starting. Due to the mechanics of the fight you have a million threat lead on everyone else so threat is not an issue. You turn off autoattack and just use your normal rotation with a macro to turn off autoattack after judgement.

How much threat do you actually loose, and how much mitigation do you gain?

Assuming you are using SoV, your threat from White Damage is pretty minimal. If you just keep up a 96969 rotation canceling autoattack after judgment you will still refresh SoV (from hammer proc) but shouldn't actually do any white attacks.

This means you don't get parried at all, which should lower your damage taken.

You will be loosing ~300 white DPS which is ~420 TPS

Assume a boss attacks with a 2.0 attack speed, and you with a 1.6 speed.

The average boss has a ~15% parry rate. Average prot paladin has a ~5% expertise so that makes for a 10% parry rate.

In a 1min period you attack 60/1.6=37.5 times. With a 10% parry rate thats ~4 parries a min.

Each parry speeds up the autoattack speed of a mob by 40%, to a minimum of 20% of remaining time. According to some Elitist jerks thread this works out to a 24% increase in speed on average.

This means you take an extra ~1 hit a min. Or an increase from 30 to 31 which is a 3% increase in damage taken.

At the moment we have an absurd threat lead. Would you take 3% more damage for a paltry 420 TPS?

If you don't need to, by all means. Your logic makes sense.
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In Soviet Russia, shield slams YOU!
Chuck Norris is my off tank.

I think the answer you are looking for is that you should use SoB, and commit suicide. Don't forget to factor in avoidance.
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http://armorylite.com/us/frostmane/fridmarr/

If the auto attack dps increase threat was meaningful enough to warrent a paldin stopping auto attack then blizzard has done something terrible because you would never put anyone but a paladin in front of the boss because they would be at several times higher risk of dying.

Boss attack speeds are typically 2.4 with the slows tanking classes have. Also you should model 1.8, 2.0 and 2.4 player swing speeds. Also model additional attacks made by the boss. Also model player avoidance as stated earlier.

Also a 300 dps loss could be meaningful.
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I made a port to exodar. My friend proceeds to MD Alar onto the AFK tank, and we both run. People ran with us, until the port, and realised it was to exodar. Only three of us went through. Turns out people would rather die than go to exodar. -Infurnus

On your avoidance, I don't think your avoidance will affect the result, since you will still take the same % of extra damage just the starting number of times hit will be less.

If special attacks are 50% of the bosses damage, then you will only be saving 1.5% damage by not attacking.

The loss of 300DPS might well not be worth sacrificing 3% of boss auto-attack damage.

I know when I was doing prince P2 with nub healers, I would turn off autoattack simply because I had a massive threat lead, and a parry could result in a Thrash->Thrash combo which would be difficult to heal up. Prince is a special case though, since his white damage is the vast majority of his damage (since Thrash had a % proc chance on hit.)

No boss in WOTLK yet has such punishing auto-attack that this is required, I think. Patchwerk barely touches the MT compared to the OTs, and I think he might have parry-haste disabled anyway.

Something to think about though.

I read somewhere else that deflection doesn't cause parry haste. I haven't tested myself though.

Although I do enjoy the play of thoughts, I'm not going to deal less damage and threat and stop leeching from a double judged mob (even though I don't have reckoning atm).
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Ythalaine - Die Aldor EU

Bosses have closser to an 11% parry chance meaning most tankadins will already be half way through that.

Auto attacking is not an issue with damage intake its more of a concern for warriors.

Azgalor still has parry hastened attacks tho so its likely some bosses still have it.
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To face death and glory with an equal smile

You premise is incorrect, and thus your argument is meaningless.

My average non-critical white hit is 3k, and white damage is 20-23% of my DPS @ about 500 DPS.

http://wowwebstats.com/1heppgims6pos?a=x24260d1&s=70370-107292

In fact, once ShoR 1,2 go on the same CD, melee will be my #1 DPS source by a large margin, currently it ties for first place because I'm abusing the bug.

I have 4.75% expertise from gear without stacking it at all, and the standard 1.5% from talents. I'm also using a 2.5 speed weapon, which is handy for this calc, but perhaps not common. My gear is pretty average, mostly 10-man and heroic ilevel 200 stuff, thus bugger all expertise. SoV glyph will add another 2.5%.

Anyway, it ends up at about half an extra swing from the boss per minute, which has at least half chance of being avoided.

So using auto-attack on your standard 4 minute boss fight amounts to "one extra hit". Of course... your auto-attack damage means that you kill him earlier, and thus he swings less often.

Using the last Patchwerk I have a log for: http://wowwebstats.com/1heppgims6pos?s=70370-107292&m it pretty much exactly cancels out. He hits me one extra time due to parry haste (assuming he can haste), but dies 2 seconds earlier due to my white DPS.

Thus: Turning off auto-attack is stupid, even ignoring the fact that most bosses that have heavy burst DPS deliberately have parry-haste turned off.

Last point: If you want to be Emodin and tank by hurting yourself with SoB, feel free, but you're ignoring reality to try and prove your "point" with the white damage argument.
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This isn't the "Offtankadin" forum.
Knaughty
Naxx-25 15/15 pre-buff

I don't think I personaly would drop auto attack all together from a tough boss fight. As knaughty, said killing it faster may avoid more hit's then avoiding any parry.

Mabey stopping auto attack for strategic times, like after the healer is stunned and your not at full health. Not sure how realistic a technique like that would be.
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Limitation strictly defined by motivation - Edan
Warning. I edit my posts.

If the parry damage is even mildly important in your opinion, then just get to expertise cap? ^^
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"Pleasure in the job puts perfection in the work."

"Education is an ornament in prosperity and refuge in adversity."

Considering how easy it is to hit the soft cap now with just glyph of seal of vengeance and what normally comes on tanking gear, this isn't really needed is it? Maybe back in BC it was worth it. But definitely not anymore.
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